top of page

Episode 496: The Embrace of Tyrants & the Despair of Pastors


A scary number of Americans now say violence may be necessary to fix the country. A new report looks at what combination of beliefs cause a person to endorse political violence, and why it’s more common on the right. Then, in response to last week’s interview, Phil unpacks how our modern belief in human goodness explains the rise in authoritarianism and populism. And, why are U.S. Christians supporting the “Freedom Convoy” in Canada?


A recent study from Barna found more than one-third of pastors have seriously considered leaving ministry in the last year. What’s behind this crisis? Is the problem our culture, church members, how we’ve structured ministry, or is it pastors themselves? Skye talks to Glenn Packiam about his new book, “The Resilient Pastor,” and why it’s time to reexamine our assumptions about the church and its leadership. Plus, scientists create an artificial fish powered by love.


Get involved with episode 500! Visit our Patreon for details: https://www.patreon.com/holypost


News Segment

0:00 - Intro/updates from the crew 4:44 - Valentine’s Day 6:39 - Animal News https://newatlas.com/robotics/biohybrid-fish-human-heart-cells/

13:08 - Recap: Last week’s interview with Robert Tracy McKenzie https://www.holypost.com/post/episode-495-the-false-gospel-of-democracy-with-robert-tracy-mckenzie

50:53 - News segment wrap-up


Sponsor 53:04 - Faithful Counseling faithfulcounseling.com/holypost


Interview with Glenn Packiam

54:17 - Interview intro 56:19 - “Pastor” definition and recent Barna stats 1:00:07 - Glenn Packiam’s story/pilgrimage 1:04:02 - Tension in how pastors spend their time 1:13:44 - Authority 1:21:10 - Slowing down 1:28:10 - What’s next?


The Holy Post is supported by our listeners. We may earn affiliate commissions through links listed here. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.




8 Comments


Skye, Love the show and really enjoyed your interview with Glenn Packiam. We need more than ever for our pastors to be spirit led, and it truly saddens me the percentage that struggle with carving space to attend to their own souls. How can they feed congregations when they are spiritually starving? Don't know if you are familiar with the ministry of the Transforming Center, but it is in your back yard! Their two-year program for pastors and leaders is specifically designed to help leaders care for their souls. Thank you for being a voice pointing people to a deeper faith in these dark times.

Like

An issue with the first part of this: the attitude toward the Canadian protesters was ironic given the comments about making sure we understand other people points of view. Maybe it wasn’t the intention but it came off as very condescending (the only reason they’re protesting is because they are watching American TV? Give them some credit for thinking up their own ideas). As much as I appreciate how much this show is trying to correct the course of American Christianity, I have felt as late that there is an attitude of judgement and dismissal of many of more conservative, rural and less educated brothers and sisters in Christ. This creates more anger, not less.

Like
Replying to

Urban-rural divide: yes, there's a lot of that. I have a lot of friends on both sides of it. I'm doing my best not to be dismissive or condescending but it can be hard when the trains of reasoning that they (the ruralites) are following are so gap-toothed, that there's a reason why I abandoned them as a young adult.


They may not be watching any American TV but they're listening to hard-right pod-casts (whether American or not) and it was a Canadian who first told me that I should watch Fox News 50% of the time to get a balanced viewpoint.


As regards the Canadian protesters -- in the largest urban areas, support for them is in the toilet.…


Like

Paul K
Paul K
Feb 17, 2022

What Phil was referencing is “black and white” thinking, which Robert J. Lifton identities as “The Demand for Purity”. I think the solution starts with ourselves, our families, and our churches. Learn to think like Proverbs instead of an authoritarian and teach your children to think the same.

Like

emma.rebekah
emma.rebekah
Feb 17, 2022

I know a big topic on our minds and in your discussions is: how have these Christians gone from declaring biblical truths and affirming the church to all of a sudden abandoning all of these principles for an unprincipled leader? You've already touched on this several times, I just had some additional thoughts on it (or maybe I'm rephrasing what you've already said).


I think it's all about power. When it has served these 'Christians' to spout biblical truths because it gave them status, a hierarchical standing, dominance (moral and otherwise), then they spouted biblical truths (or the select ones that enhance that status, dominance, etc). But, when standing for biblical truths would in some way mean they take away…


Like
emma.rebekah
emma.rebekah
Feb 17, 2022
Replying to

... when I think of the church today, I think of the Parable of the Weeds in Matt 13.

Like

Skye and Phil, I was really struck by the "Be careful who is discipling your flock...if it isn't you, it's not your flock" statement. That is where we are at in our church right now. We are well divided by the "unity" that the freedom truck convoy has brought to light. And it isn't a mandate vs no mandate division, in this case everyone is against vaccine mandates, but some are also not impressed with the convoy and others are. Add into it some masking/governmental authority issues and we are a mess.


So, if someone else is discipling a flock, what does church leadership and the pastor do? As the former moderator (and my dad is the current one, w…

Like
bottom of page