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586: What We Get Wrong About Heaven (Hint: Almost Everything) with Skye Jethani

Skye’s new book “What If Jesus Was Serious About Heaven?” Is here! Kaitlyn interviews him about the book, why popular Christian beliefs about heaven are so often unbiblical, and how heaven can become an idol that replaces Jesus as the center of our faith. Also this week: Reactions to the war that’s erupted in Israel. How will the End Times industry spin this unprecedented attack? Phil returns from Nashville with insights about why evangelicals are bad at comedy but good at anger. Kaitlyn learns what a “hutchmoot” is. And the Holy Post (producer) has a baby!

Holy Post Plus:

Getting Schooled - Taylor Swift 101

Why I’m Still a Christian Bonus Episode with Philip Yancey

0:00 - Intro

0.51 - Show starts

1:57 - Theme Song

2:20 - Sponsor - Sundays Dog Food

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3:33 - Israel at War with Hammas

14:42 - Why aren’t Christians funny?

41:40 - Sponsor - Fabric by Gerber Life

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42:50 - Sponsor - Dreamland Baby

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44:05 - Interview Intro

45:58 - Why Heaven and what we get wrong about it

55:47 - The Kingdom of Heaven

1:02:57 - Dangers of escapist mentality

1:21:33 - End Credits

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What if Jesus Was Serious About Heaven? By Skye Jethani

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Hortle Bortle
Hortle Bortle
Oct 19, 2023

You know, you can't laugh at the Babylon Bee because you're sympathetic to Progressive ideas and ways of seeing reality. That doesn't mean you aren't a Christian or anything like that, necessarily, but it does mean that, like almost all people experiencing leftiness, you're unable to see what is funny about your own ways and means. That is part of what makes people whose thinking is like what yours appears to be so brittle, and, paradoxically, funny. It's just that you'll never be able to laugh along, and that's sad. As a humor critic and political observer, you were a truly brilliant Bob the Tomato, and one of a kind. As a proggish Christian influencer fundy-disparaging type, you're just one…


TJ MacDougall
TJ MacDougall
Oct 12, 2023

I've heard so many sermons from preachers who think they are stand up comics. They a usually not very funny, nor are they usually saying anything of value. I think the trend was started by Mark Driscoll. Frankly I think we could do with less of this type of preaching. I am not comfortable with conflating preaching with stand up comedy. I'm not saying that the crew was conflating the two, but when Skye made the comparison, it made me think of this.


As for why people imagine Heaven as a place where everyone is just having a never-ending worship service, one can think they're wrong (I certainly think so) without assuming some cynical reason. People can be mistaken without it being nefarious. I don't think that people have that rather bogus/childish image of Heaven because pastors are being self-promoting any more than I think that the idea of sitting on clouds all day in white robes playing harps (possibly with wings and halos--the souls, I mean, not the harps, which would be weird) is because meteorologists are trying to promote clouds. I think some of this might be the approach to Scripture as (1) literal in virtually every passage and (2…


Regarding the notion that there is something wrong with Greek philosophy being part of how Christianity has approached some things--you say that like it's a bad thing. ;) Seriously, I don't see a reason to think that's a problem. I also really don't think that the traditions and theology of the Christian church, particularly the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic end of the spectrum (in which I include Anglican and to some degree Lutheran, etc.), from basically the beginning and for two thousand years since, are a problem for developing a more complex understanding of the passages in both the Old and New Testament. This applies to Jesus saying He will prepare a place for us, that there are …


I'm sorry, Skye, you got me chuckling at 1h12'52" when you blamed the belief that the earth isn't eternal on "Pluto". I KNOW you meant Plato but now I've got this image attached to ancient Greek dualism. Aristotle is not impressed with how we're dissing his teacher. But Socrates, ever the joker is amused...

are you mature enough not to be offended (c.f. the pre-interview phase) ...ank

Replying to

I don't agree with Plato on everything, certainly, but I definitely believe there is value in his notion of what we generally call "Platonism," especially in the Christian -- not heretical or Gnostic, but traditional and orthodox -- approach to such matters. As Lewis' character Digory said in The Last Battle, "It's all in Plato, all in Plato..."

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