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613: Driscoll, Dawkins, & Political Discipleship with Curtis Chang

Atheist Richard Dawkins has said he doesn’t believe one word of the Christian faith, but he now considers himself a “cultural Christian” and wants to defend the Christian values of his country against the influence of Islam and immigrants. Does this represent an alignment between the New Atheists and Christian Nationalists? Curtis Chang shares about “The After Party”—the new curriculum he’s developed with David French and Russel Moore to help Christians focus on hope and humility rather than partisanship. Also this week, Mark Driscoll gets booted from a men’s conference. And another infraction by a Florida man with a Bible.

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Getting Schooled - Mariah W. Stewart

0:00 - Intro

1:02 - Show Starts

3:02 - Theme Song

3:23 - Sponsor - Sundays Dog Food - Get 35% off your first order of Sundays. Go to or use code HOLYPOST at checkout.

4:35 - Florida Man Scales Tower with Bible

12:00 - Mark Driscoll Kicked Off Stage After Calling Sword-Swallower a “Jezebel Spirit”

22:35 - Richard Dawkins, the “Cultural Christian”

36:40 - Dusty Deavers, the Country Singin’ Senator

50:46 - Sponsor - Blueland - Get 15% off your first order by going to

51:54  - Sponsor - Hatch - Form better bedtime habits today with Hatch—$20 off and free shipping when you order the Restore at

52:55 - Interview

1:04:34 - The “What” vs the “How”

1:16:26 - Four Quadrant of Political Engagement

1:27:19 - End Credits

Links Mentioned in the News Segment:

Florida Man Climbs Cell Phone Tower

Sword-Swallower on a Pole and Mark Driscoll

Richard Dawkins and Cultural Christianity

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10 Yorum

At about 26 minutes in, Kaitlyn says we that we should recognize that values such as the inherent dignity of all humans doesn't come from nowhere, it comes from Christianity. I think those values predate Christianity - they are inherent in the ten commandments and it wouldn't surprise me if they show up in earlier religions.

Also, here's an interview with Thich Nhat Hanh in which he speaks of Buddhist practices of love of oneself and extending that to love of one's community and help others. That sounds a lot like respecting human dignity and loving one's neighbor to me. (

I'm an atheist, one with empathy and one who works hard to help people others in need. I see…


I told my husband about the turducken analogy. He said there's so much wrong with this whole event that it should make it painfully obvious that we've lost the plot (hence the chicken inside the duck inside the turkey inside the ostrich 😅).

He compared it to "jumping the shark". Dr.Google says "jump the shark" is a term that is used to argue that a creative work or entity has reached a point in which it has exhausted its core intent and is introducing new ideas that are discordant with, or an extreme exaggeration of, its original purpose.

Maybe that's why there are so many wild things at conferences and youth events. Definitely things that are "discordant with their original…


I haven’t gotten all the way through the Dawkins part of the discussion, but I do note that the common ground that Dawkins and Christian nationalists have is hating Muslims (or even xenophobia) and I find that tragic and vile. I hope something will be said about this further along in the podcast than I am currently… I would rather have a kind Muslim family as next-door neighbors than either Christian nationalists or someone like Dawkins any day of the week.

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I was fascinated by the discussion which went round and round and round on some rather ridiculous points instead of calling out and examining the obvious - that this seems like a racist statement on its face which is what we can expect when a person removes the Christ from Christianity. Seems the same thing that often happens with the abortion discussions where the most relevant problems are relegated to the corner shadows where hopefully no one will notice them. Sigh….come on guys.


I don’t think Driscoll switching out “the Jezebel spirit” for something about Sodom and Gomorrah would have been a step up. We’ve already got enough homophobia without adding more, even if it’s to replace misogyny.

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I’m glad she called this misogyny out. Whether we realize it or not (I’ve recently realized it) the church has been reinforcing a second-class citizenship of women in numerous ways and we need to keep calling it out when we see it. Things seem to be getting better in some circles and worse in others - again, if you see something, say something. My name is Dale….and I’m a woman.


Oh, Turduckin! Delicious barnyard abomination! Make nice with the Cajun folk in your life and if you play your cards right, one of them just might overnight you a Cajun spiced turduckin from the swamp for Thanksgiving. It's even better than Skye described. It's a turkey stuffed with a duck stuffed with a chicken stuffed with pig (pork sausage cornbread stuffing.) My brother's son is half Cajun on his mother's side. She has a tenuous relationship with her father, the boy's Cajun Grampa. My brother has always been conscientious to annually send him a year's worth of photos of the boy and make time to let them see him when they visit from out of state. Cajun Grampa sen…

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